[Vp-integration-subgroup] [Vp-reproduce-subgroup] White paper revision

Tue Aug 3 06:42:48 PDT 2021

Hi Alex,

You may have joined late,  yet you are relatively active. This is a good
sign.

We do need to reach agreement to transfer the publication to a 3rd party,
we did reach it for the version we had before you joined. However,  the
idea is to include wide support for this paper. So if indeed the path opens
and we reach agreement, your contributions can be added later during
revisions.

I cannot foresee the future,  yet my hopes are that guidance from a 3rd
party may accelerate dissemination.

I look forward for more discussion.

             Jacob

On Tue, Aug 3, 2021, 03:10 Alexander Kulesza <
alexander.kulesza at novadiscovery.com> wrote:

> Dear Jacob,
> Thanks for your feedback. I thought the poll to be a good indicator of the
> overall activity of the authors. Also, if there is significant vote on
> "don't agree" then any discussion (which anyway will be needed before any
> action or decision is taken) has little chance of being productive.
>
>  As I joined relatively late, I do not feel comfortable to lead the
> discussion of next steps, as I would not be sure if the interests of the
> initial and lead authors would be well represented.  Currently, I agree
> that it is hard to anticipate what the timeframe is or what obstacles there
> might be for the group to reach consensus (or non-objection) for a the
> current status of the document.
>
> I personally like the idea of the Frontiers in Systems Biology as venue.
>
> Kind regards
> Alexander
>
>
> On Mon, 2 Aug 2021 at 17:45, Jacob Barhak <jacob.barhak at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi Alex,
>>
>> Thanks for your response first - it is the first public response.
>>
>> However, I was hoping for a discussion rather than a poll. We already
>> made a vote and the direction it took us all ended up badly so far - there
>> is no activity for a few months now. Perhaps a discussion is in order
>> before making more decisions.
>>
>> And Alex, time is something you manage to achieve certain goals with
>> certain priorities.
>>
>> The real question is if circulating this paper is on a high priority list
>> for any of the contributors?
>>
>> Some contributors publicly declared they have little time, yet we were
>> still able to push though in the past. What has changed?
>>
>> Perhaps a discussion will reveal those things.
>>
>>                     Jacob
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 2, 2021 at 2:00 AM Alexander Kulesza <
>> alexander.kulesza at novadiscovery.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Dear all, Dear Jacob,
>>>
>>> I hope that I speak for many others from this group wishing that the
>>> ideas presented in that paper do get circulated; optimally in form of a
>>> reviewed paper.
>>>
>>> I think that the time of the year impedes many of us (including myself)
>>> to spend the time needed to edit the sections.
>>> I have created the following poll
>>> https://doodle.com/poll/ydpgvgi594ubi82d?utm_source=poll&utm_medium=link
>>> which intends to get agreement or disgreement of the group for the
>>> different optuions that exist.
>>>
>>> Please let me know what you think.
>>> Alexander
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, 29 Jul 2021 at 16:54, Jacob Barhak <jacob.barhak at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Greetings contributors,
>>>>
>>>> Two of the contributors approach me about this message privately.
>>>> However, there were many more who participated and no one responded
>>>> publicly in 2 weeks.
>>>>
>>>> Do you not want this paper be circulated?
>>>>
>>>> I am asking those questions publicly since this deserves a public
>>>> discussion.
>>>>
>>>> Hopefully this reminder will stir up the group.
>>>>
>>>>             Jacob
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Jul 14, 2021 at 4:46 PM Jacob Barhak <jacob.barhak at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Gilberto,
>>>>>
>>>>> As you can see, there was no response to your email - in fact the
>>>>> paper writing stopped - I waited sufficient time to make sure this is the
>>>>> case to prove a point. If there is no one to tend to the editing, then
>>>>> there will not be any progress and the paper will lose focus -
>>>>> partially because people will pull it in many directions and resolution
>>>>> will take time no one is willing to provide to move it forward. And this is
>>>>> what happened here.
>>>>>
>>>>> I remind you that I wrote what needs to be done to make progress. See
>>>>> the 4 points in this archived email:
>>>>>
>>>>> https://lists.simtk.org/pipermail/vp-reproduce-subgroup/2021-May/000098.html
>>>>>
>>>>> By now it's fairly safe to declare that the group failed to fulfil
>>>>> those points in reasonable time, and the revised version is in a worse
>>>>> condition towards publication than the version we all agreed to submit
>>>>> before.
>>>>>
>>>>> This situation raises the question.
>>>>>
>>>>> Is there more benefit from submitting the findings we had before as
>>>>> they were to a 3rd party for publication than waiting for revisions to end?
>>>>>
>>>>> I personally doubt that any further revisions will allow publication
>>>>> in reasonable time - which as I mentioned before delays science rather than
>>>>> advancing it.
>>>>>
>>>>> I assume that this email will start a debate with different opinions,
>>>>> that may take a long time and this is not my intention. My purpose is
>>>>> practical -  I am trying to salvage the paper so it gets published quickly.
>>>>> It is better than waiting forever...
>>>>>
>>>>> I believe that what we accumulated and summarized in a table is worth
>>>>> publication as we agreed before. We did reach a consensus and I hope
>>>>> individuals will realize this is the most practical course of action.
>>>>>
>>>>> Revisions can continue and information added for future versions, yet
>>>>> I do ask that this paper be submitted quickly to a venue that will accept
>>>>> it in the form we agreed upon.
>>>>>
>>>>> If we do not do this, we will be guilty of delaying science.
>>>>>
>>>>> Hopefully contributors will realize this and we can proceed to fix the
>>>>> situation quickly.
>>>>>
>>>>>            Jacob
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Jun 21, 2021 at 1:06 PM Gilberto Gonzalez-Parra <
>>>>> gilberto.gonzalezparra at nmt.edu> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Dear all,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I like Eric's idea  i.e.  "section heads can look at the technical
>>>>>> aspects of their respective sections this week."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There are many suggestions and I think the section heads can focus in
>>>>>> one section to make the work more manageable. Then we can read the whole
>>>>>> manuscript to check the consistency of the manuscript. Overall, I think we
>>>>>> can focus on two main ideas. One to point out the challenges of Biosimulation
>>>>>> Model Reproducibility and Model Integration, and some initial basic ideas
>>>>>> to tackle these issues. That might be the main message of the article (??)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ***************************************************************************
>>>>>> Gilberto C. Gonzalez-Parra, Ph.D in Applied Mathematics.
>>>>>> Faculty of the Mathematics Department
>>>>>> New Mexico Tech, NM, USA.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ****************************************************************************
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 21, 2021 at 8:16 AM Eric Forgoston <
>>>>>> eric.forgoston at montclair.edu> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dear all,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It seems that progress has mostly stalled - there are numerous
>>>>>>> comments/edits that have been suggested and are waiting to be acted upon by
>>>>>>> the section heads.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I suggest a renewed effort over the next week or so: perhaps section
>>>>>>> heads can look at the technical aspects of their respective sections this
>>>>>>> week. Then, if interested, I can set up a poll for a discussion next week
>>>>>>> that will serve to resolve and finalise any remaining issues.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thoughts?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best wishes,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Eric
>>>>>>> ---------------------
>>>>>>> Dr. Eric Forgoston
>>>>>>> Professor of Applied Mathematics
>>>>>>> Chair, Department of Applied Mathematics and Statistics
>>>>>>> Montclair State University
>>>>>>> Montclair, NJ  07043 USA
>>>>>>> +1 973 655-7242
>>>>>>> https://eric-forgoston.github.io/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 21, 2021 at 5:54 AM Alexander Kulesza <
>>>>>>> alexander.kulesza at novadiscovery.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hello all,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> regarding the manuscript, what is the deadline for contributions? I
>>>>>>>> try to find another slot for a  working session this and next week. Please
>>>>>>>> let me know where help is needed in terms of editing.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ALexander
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Mon, 24 May 2021 at 18:00, John Gennari <gennari at uw.edu> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Eric:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Yes, I do see your changes. Thanks!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> -John G.
>>>>>>>>> On 5/24/2021 4:47 AM, Eric Forgoston wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hi Jacob and all,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I did rewrite the stochastic section adding in material from me
>>>>>>>>> and comments from William and James G. The only material I removed had been
>>>>>>>>> written by myself originally.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Additional comments are welcome.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Eric
>>>>>>>>> ---------------------
>>>>>>>>> Dr. Eric Forgoston
>>>>>>>>> Professor of Applied Mathematics
>>>>>>>>> Chair, Department of Applied Mathematics and Statistics
>>>>>>>>> Montclair State University
>>>>>>>>> Montclair, NJ  07043 USA
>>>>>>>>> +1 973 655-7242
>>>>>>>>> https://eric-forgoston.github.io/
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 24, 2021 at 6:55 AM William Waites <wwaites at ieee.org>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> > Otherwise, all I saw was …
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> There was editing of the section on stochasticity by Eric with
>>>>>>>>>> some input from myself.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> Vp-reproduce-subgroup mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> Vp-reproduce-subgroup at lists.simtk.org
>>>>>>>>>> https://lists.simtk.org/mailman/listinfo/vp-reproduce-subgroup
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Vp-reproduce-subgroup mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Vp-reproduce-subgroup at lists.simtk.org
>>>>>>>>> https://lists.simtk.org/mailman/listinfo/vp-reproduce-subgroup
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Alexander Kulesza
>>>>>>>> Team leader
>>>>>>>> Modeling & simulation / Biomodeling
>>>>>>>> alexander.kulesza at novadiscovery.com
>>>>>>>> +33 7 82 92 44 62
>>>>>>>> nova
>>>>>>>> DISCOVERY
>>>>>>>> www.novadiscovery.com
>>>>>>>> 1 Place Verrazzano, 69009 Lyon
>>>>>>>> +33 9 72 53 13 01
>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>> https://lists.simtk.org/mailman/listinfo/vp-reproduce-subgroup
>>>>>>
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>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Alexander Kulesza
>>> Team leader
>>> Modeling & simulation / Biomodeling
>>> alexander.kulesza at novadiscovery.com
>>> +33 7 82 92 44 62
>>> nova
>>> DISCOVERY
>>> www.novadiscovery.com
>>> 1 Place Verrazzano, 69009 Lyon
>>> +33 9 72 53 13 01
>>>
>>> *This message is intended only for the personal and confidential use of
>>> the designated recipient(s) named above. If you are not the intended
>>> recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any review,
>>> dissemination, distribution or copying of this message is strictly
>>> prohibited. Email transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or
>>> error-free. Therefore, we do not represent that this information is
>>> complete or accurate and it should not be relied upon as such. All
>>> information is subject to change without notice.*
>>
>>
>
> --
> Alexander Kulesza
> Team leader
> Modeling & simulation / Biomodeling
> alexander.kulesza at novadiscovery.com
> +33 7 82 92 44 62
> nova
> DISCOVERY
> www.novadiscovery.com
> 1 Place Verrazzano, 69009 Lyon
> +33 9 72 53 13 01
>
> *This message is intended only for the personal and confidential use of
> the designated recipient(s) named above. If you are not the intended
> recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any review,
> dissemination, distribution or copying of this message is strictly
> prohibited. Email transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or
> error-free. Therefore, we do not represent that this information is
> complete or accurate and it should not be relied upon as such. All
> information is subject to change without notice.*
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